If you have read IndyBravest lately, there has been a lot of talk about the problems with the IFD Civillian EMS division. With everything new, there are bound to be problems, whenever there is change, there are bound to be people against it. Lets talk about some of these problems. What are your ideas? More staffing? Scrap the whole transporting idea and turn it over to Wishard or someone else who wants to do it? BLS transporting trucks with ALS squads on dual response? A third service EMS service in the county? Has the whole transporting EMS been more involved than anyone thought it would be? Is it worth the hassle? What are the higher up's in the department and the union saying about the EMS division? Let's hear it. This is the place & we are listening.
Dee
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Indy EMS, your local 3rd service blog. We are not the police, and no matter what our uniforms say, most of us are not firefighters. This is our site. This is where we can come to exchange ideas, develop plans, and yes even vent. Please keep it clean, on point, and respectful to others and their ideas. Oh yeah, and don't forget HIPPA. We wouldn't want to end up unemployed or in court for a slip of the tongue. Read. Post & Enjoy.
39 comments:
As fire consolidation moves county wide, I believe that either IFD should provide civilian ambulance service in the entire IFD area (taking in ambulances from the remaining townships and absorbing the current Wishard/H&H service) or hand over all ambulances to Wishard/H&H and have them do all the transports in IFD's entire area. Either way, the Wishard EMTs and Paramedics should be brought up to at least parity in pay with the current IFD civilian EMS division.
Is it worth the hastle? To who? There are dedicated and professional paramedics, especially in Bat 4 who come to work and run circles around the ff's when it comes to work load. All the EMS division needs to do is provide us with good manpower, equipment, and continuing education. We will take care of the rest. The union can handle all the pay and benefit issues. If you think letting Wishard run the show is a good idea, you are basically telling the public you don't care about providing the best possible EMS service you can. While I'm on the topic....Phase out civilian EMT's. The ambulances should ALL be dual paramedic to provide the highest level of care at all times to the public. Chief Sanford thinks so, I think so, Mike Reeves thinks so, and NFPA 1710 thinks so as well. There are only a few good EMT's out there, most aren't worth the paper their cert was printed on. But, if you don't mind mediocre service and 10 minute responses from downtown, let Wishard run the show.
Wishard will always run circles around IFD ambulances! Who are you trying to fool? There is nothing wrong with Wishard's service!
I don't know who you are, but no one on IFD respects Chief Sanford or Mike Reeves! Sanford should be a Captain somewhere out on the streets, and Reeves is on his way out!
A few good EMT's? You must be talking about the ones staffing the ambulances who think 6 months on the job makes it okay to walk in with their arms swinging or holding a clip board so as not to have to touch the cot. Waiting for 10 minute responses from Wishard ambulances from downtown? I suppose the Batt. 4 and Batt. 2 ambulances don't transport to downtown hospitals to avoid this problem?
Just because there is a higher run load doesn't mean jack squat about what QUALITY of service you provide at Wishard. And if you would take a second to get to know Chief Sanford, you would know he truly cares about having the BEST ems service possible. At Warren Twp, it was always a team effort. None of this sit in a chair in the bay, park your truck outside, don't eat meals, and all the other bull*&$% you have to put up with at Wishard. I'd take Chief Sanford over Chuck Ford anyday!!!!
Can you explain why Chief Sanford should be a captain on the streets? I mean other than the obvious facts of him being a great officer and better Chief. I know of approximately 95 firefighters on IFD that respect Chief Sanford.
Seems most of the IFD ems service got their experience wearing white and working for WMH. 24 hr shifts are bad on the budget and bad for the public. The research is starting to show that busy services, dual medic or not, is best served by shorter shifts. We make less that way but if we wanted money we would be on a ladder.
Bat 2 and 4 ambulances absolutely transport downtown. What they don't do is mark in way out of their district, catch a run, and either take 10 minutes to get there or send dispatch scrambling looking for a new truck. Tell why the hell M29 marks in service at St Vincents???? And the good EMT's aren't at IFD, they are the ones I was talking about. If you properly manage response areas and run loads, 24 hour shifts are perfectly fine. I agree M11 and the like can never be 24 hour trucks. But M12 averages 5 runs in 24 hours. If you can't handle that run load, maybe 12 hour shifts are better for you. Here's a thought, eat well, exercise, get rest when you can. It works. And how are 24 hour shifts bad on the budget? You don't want to make fair wage? You enjoy having to work 2 or more jobs to make the bills? Wishard Hospital is screwing you, not IFD. Don't be pissed if IFD civilian medics are making more than you, ALL medics deserve more pay.
Anonymous said...
Can you explain why Chief Sanford should be a captain on the streets? I mean other than the obvious facts of him being a great officer and better Chief. I know of approximately 95 firefighters on IFD that respect Chief Sanford.
March 20, 2008 5:28 PM
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HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!
You keep living in your little dream world! You'll be ok!
I think one thing that should be mentioned is that the civilian EMS is so put down by the firefighters that it isn't even funny. What they need to realize is, if it weren't for the "few good EMT's" and the ones who aren't worth the paper their certs are printed on, all the little subbies and probies would be riding the bus. Guess that wouldn't make them a "firefighter" either, huh?
Why should tax payers pay for an ambulance 3 times. EVERY property tax payer pays a tax for an ambulance provided by the county namely Health and Hospital Corporation. The fire departments in their infinite wisdom many years back, to justify hiring more firefighters, put them on ambulances. Now the fire departments are increasing their budgets to provide the same service that the taxpayers already pay for thus raising taxes. A few years back the fire departments had the legislation changed to add a paramedic service tax to help bolster their tax revenues. If some of the people on this and other blogs would do alittle research, just alittle, they would find out that the "10" minute response time that has been quoted is actually lower then the national average for cities our size and or bigger. The days of ambulances sitting in bays with civillians waiting for runs will soon be over. The Warren medic trucks can vouch for that since their run loads have increased. And by the way the ems civillians that work for the City of Indianapolis (Washington) and IFD (Warren) do get paid differently within their own organization. We should be trying to come together for a common cause rather then bashing each other because we know where we came from and others do to. The local does not much care about the civillians. The civillians should be looking to other organized labor organizations to represent them.
http://www.jems.com/news_and_articles/articles/24-Hour_Shifts_May_Endanger_Patients_and_Employees.html
http://www.jems.com/news_and_articles/articles/Studying_Sleep_Deprivation.html
There are a few very quick studies showing 24hrs leads to mistakes and increased medical problems with employees. If this county or city goes to one ambulance service then the shifts need to be the same. It would create admin problems to have multiple shifts. Think about pay roll and hour issues. There needs to be a similar shift rotation to make pay, vacations, and trading easy and fair. Ok so maybe Sanford is a great guy and he knows what he is doing but having merit over civilians never works and the civilians always loose. Third service is the best way to go because IFD (traditional IFD) has too much stigma against EMS a(its not everyone but it is there).
FYI dispatch should already have had GPS set up and know where everyone is. Wishard has no choice but to mark in within 15min or be punished by the stats guy.
There are approx. 35-40 (911) ambulances in Marion county, inservice, at any given time. They should all be under the same employer. Be it Wishard, IFD, or Health and Hospital. With GPS it can be assured the closest unit goes to the run. 12 hour shifts are a much better alternative. (Would you want someone working on your child after they had been asleep 2 hours and had done 8 or 10 runs?)
I believe the most important thing is that someone needs make a decision and make it soon. I've be around a long time and the morale is the lowest I have seen it.
What part is the dream????
I have read all these statements, stop with the rude and disrespecttful comments. It merely comes down to politics. It is what it is. This should not be IFD against Wishard and vice versa. I don't know Chuck Ford no comment there. I have met Sanford, he seems like a nice guy trying to do the best he can with little support. I work a 24 hour shift and have done 12-14 runs and not be run down. I take care of myself. It does seem as if M2 and M24 picks chooses their runs. Nothing will work if you all keep this bull!@#$ up.
IFD EMS is just fine, I see most of the hated comments are coming from Wishard crews, I'm sure just one or two people, there always seems to be one or two that are whinners even on IFD side. This is about politics. I don't believe that IFD will go dual medics, that is a bigger budget. I have worked with some good and not so good EMT's, just know the same is true about paramedics. There are LAZY people everywhere. This blog is nothing more that a b!#@ session. If want anything to work be proactive. No one is better than anyone else, it just takes a person willing to be better and commited to their job.
Anonymous said...
What part is the dream????
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March 21, 2008 7:19 PM
Anonymous said...
Can you explain why Chief Sanford should be a captain on the streets? I mean other than the obvious facts of him being a great officer and better Chief. I know of approximately 95 firefighters on IFD that respect Chief Sanford.
March 20, 2008 5:28 PM
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The part where 95% of the firefighters on IFD respects Chief Sanford. That's the dream!
He was handed a Deputy Chief's position because of the merger. If it wasn't for that, he would be a Captain on the streets somewhere.
What a joke!
Leave Chief Sanford out of this, he has done nothing to you, are you that jealous?
It doesnt say 95%. It says approximatley 95 firefighters on IFD. That about how many we brought over. Brian is a great man, leader chief captain, lt firefighter whatever.
Leave Sanford alone, Grow up, get a life, go make to where you came from.
Ok people. I'm an ex-wishard, now FF/Medic in Marion co. Here are the facts. IFD has no business in the transporting EMS service. They are as anti-ems as a fire dept can get. They do NOT care about you and neither does the L416. I feel terrible for all those Warren Medics who worked hard at making a great career move, and are now being forced back into a crappy mgmt. system (Warren folks...Im so sorry for you). Wishard has alot of good medics too, Wishards problems, are not with the street medics. It is with the half-ass retarded stupidvisors, and the idiot (C. Ford) who has ruined wishard. Pete Dillman was a jerk, but that man knew how to run an ambulance service. Band together, find a leader, like Theresa Hall, someone who is an atty. or something, and find your way out of this. Start pushing the buttons to get away from IFD. Your job will suck forever, if you don't get away from the EGO maniacs at IFD. IT WILL NEVER WORK !!!!!!
This will take some time, you are correct Warren did have a great fire/ems service. A lot of the old timers are leaving and new ones coming, there has to be an administration change with a lot of positives to change moral. I remember when working for Wishard on the ambulance used to be the prize people in ems only could dream about being apart of, your right their org sucks as well.
No GPS, just an FYI.
As a Merit Firefighter/Medic for IFD, I really do care about the EMS Division. I do not know what why so many people dislike the EMS.
I just want to say thanks and keep up the good work.
Thank you, 4:49. It does mean something, our jobs are hard enough. Sometimes I feel as if I have a mark on me, not for who I am but where I work, the Bat i'm in, and of course being a civ. All I want to do, is do the best I can and be somewhat happy. There are some people that just seem so unhappy about everything, that includes fire and ems. I can't change the way people think I can only make sure they way people think doesn't change me. Julia
Also, I'm glad I'm here at IFD. There have been good days and bad, you'll find that any where you work. I hope that there will be a solution soon, seems as if we ALL need one. This should never be an us against you and vice versa. No matter who you are employed with. The outcome is the same. I know ems can be a drag, esp when there are patients out there that abuse the system. Julia
Julia,
I just hope you're not logged on to this website from Station 4's IFD computers...wouldn't want the C Shift Engine officer to have a hissy fit...or would I?
Wishard Ambulance Service is by far the worst standard of care in Marion County including Rural Metro. Its sad to watch the best service in the state go down the toilet. I am a Paramedic today because of Wishard Paramedics which sadly none of them work for Wishard anymore. That says alot.
The Wishard medics and EMT's are getting a bad rap for something they cannot control. The management, maintainence staff (or lack there of), and their education department. I being a Wiz employee and have been for a few years have seen so many changes, heard so many things and yet I have learned to take it with a grain of salt. We do get treated poorly, have crappy equipment, unsafe vehicles, bad pay, horrible benefits (i could live off welfare and have better health coverage), and there have been over the recent years been some very bad hiring choices. People that shouldnt be anywhere near a patient, get a job only cause they have a pulse and a body temp in the 90 degree range. I have in 4 years seen the service that when I first started EMS, they were awesome.... now its basically an out right embarassment to say who I work for. But, I could go somewhere else and not bitch, but its not fair to us, or the citizens we provide care for, This is our job. I wouldnt mind a consolidation, or even going third service, but as some people have stated the current admin would have to go, which im sure 99% of us agree to that as well.
The Wishard medics and EMT's are getting a bad rap for something they cannot control. The management, maintainence staff (or lack there of), and their education department. I being a Wiz employee and have been for a few years have seen so many changes, heard so many things and yet I have learned to take it with a grain of salt. We do get treated poorly, have crappy equipment, unsafe vehicles, bad pay, horrible benefits (i could live off welfare and have better health coverage), and there have been over the recent years been some very bad hiring choices. People that shouldnt be anywhere near a patient, get a job only cause they have a pulse and a body temp in the 90 degree range. I have in 4 years seen the service that when I first started EMS, they were awesome.... now its basically an out right embarassment to say who I work for. But, I could go somewhere else and not bitch, but its not fair to us, or the citizens we provide care for, This is our job. I wouldnt mind a consolidation, or even going third service, but as some people have stated the current admin would have to go, which im sure 99% of us agree to that as well.
Your funny Lt. LOL. By the way you know I was on my Laptop.
Julia
Julia,
Log in on the 4's house computers all you want. Some of the "north side officers" need to grow up and get on the IFD ball.
It's not Washington Twp anymore.
To 04/01 6:46,
I'm not so sure it was the LT on the engine, he doesn't look at the blogs as far as I know. Since everyone now knows where i work and what station i'm at, it is hard to tell. I try to use my laptop more than the station computer. 10 people 2 computers, it's just easier that way:)
Julia
Julia,
Your station crew is lucky to have you up there. I have worked with you before and you do a great job.
Keep it up.
-Chris (6:46)
THANK YOU CHRIS!
JULIA
Ok... my turn.. Having been fortunate enough to work private service, Wishard, and I.F.D. i have seen good and bad. Does it really matter what the side of the ambulance says? I mean really? Yes there are issues with all the services. I mean Wishard used to be THE place to work EMS in Indy. They had top notch EMTs and Medics. Now they hire people who were fired other places for stealing patient meds (I know this for a fact), no experience in a fast paced 911 service, etc. Wishard is notorious for self dispatching from the street and responding from distances that are absurd. But the IFD ambulances are not with out flaws either. There are attitude issues, experience issues, etc. But again I ask.. who cares what the side of the truck says? It is going to be a while before county wide ambulance/ fire department takes place. No matter who runs it we need to grow up and do the best we can. Common sense does come into play sometimes...
Oh... and 1 last little tidbit... Contrary to popular belief, not ALL IFD firefighter medics are worthless like some think. There are some medics that ride these "big red trucks" that I would rather have at my side. I'm not saying they are all like this. Give it time.. The older firefighters who hate EMS are slowly on their way out and you will soon see firefighters hoping off their red charriots and willing AND able to step in and work.
Anon 4:29- Thank you, Just because we are not anal about our EMS doesn't mean that we don't like it or enjoy doing it. I will do what needs to be done and try to have things done if I can before the ambulance gets there. But just because I don't get in the back of the ambulance on every single run doesn't mean I don't care. I always ask if you need help or need anything. All you have to do is say yes and I will be there. Thanks
IFD Firefighter/Medic
Its like a lawn mower with no blades its just not cutting it. A majority of ifd ff/medics would rather wait on the wishard medics to get there to perform care instead of being proactive and putting on an albuterol treatment or pushing d50 "not oral glucose guys" just so they don't have to do paper work or so they can put "assist medics" on the paper work. And people want to talk about wishard medics having terrible patient care its on both sides. To me that is neglecting the patient. The reason things don't change is because when it is brought to wisards attention management brushes it under the table. We will always being walking on egg shells and it sucks...120/80....120/80
I am currently a Medic at Wishard. Every department, Wishard, IFD, and Private sector has the good bad and the worse. Unfortunately most of our bad is upper management or lack there of. With the response time, we have to be inservice with in 15 minutes or our raises (what little they are) are flushed down the toilet very quickly. For some odd reason Wishard does not like giving their runs up, upper management. So dispatch will send of from far south west to way north east on runs. Now, they are getting better at not doing that, but it still happens. Every place has problems, and none of those problems will ever get fixed if we don't stick together.
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